Theodore's World

Ignorant indeed. You, that is.

Please explain to me how these students are ignorant, stupid, users, communists, traitors to America and to our troops.

Ignorant because you don't agree with their politics?
Stupid because they stand for what they believe in?
Users? (That one really doesn't make any sense)
Communists?!? Howzat?
Traitors? You might like to think so, but you should check in with Funk and Wangalls. (You're likely a rabid Republican, and, as such, not burdened with anything as useless as an education, so I'll tell you now that Funk and Wangalls is a dictionary)
Traitors to our troops? Hardly. They more than likely support the troops who are fighting. Probably as much as if not more than you.

Pull your head out from time to time and see what's going on in the world.

Aside from what the Fright House and Faux News tell you.

So many kids in college think that because they are there they suddenly are very worldly and knowledgable. They think they are so smart they have all the answers, and their ego driven profs encourage the students along certain political lines- socialist left usually.

Who do you think is more worldly, realistic and knowledgable - a 21 yr old college student or a 21 yr old paratrooper who has been deployed twice to combat operations? You might also ask, which of these two people acts more responsibly

Vern:

I'm burdened with an education, and I'm curious about your explanation for the protest. Since you've inserted yourself into the issue, let's see if you have the guts and intelligence to continue with it.

Those students should have been charged with Civil Rights violations. Their protests prevented others from exercising their civil right to speak to the recruiters and possible get jobs or enlist in the military. Just because these products of inferior breeding didn’t want the recruiters on campus, doesn’t mean other students may be interested.

Vern,

How 'bout you dig your nose out of the socialist agenda derriere, and look around Wild Thing's site before you declare she doesn't support troops. She dearly loves military personnel. She toured with the USO during Nam. She went to the troops. She didn't throw rocks and act like an uncivilized, ranting child.

And you think the actions of these pitiful excuses for adults (that's being generous) as support for the troops. When you support someone, you don't throw rocks and hurl insults at them. Dang, if you don't sound like a Kos kid.

These are not intelligent students...these are little parrots. Intelligence comes from making good decisions and good decisions come from learning from all the bad decisions you've made. Consequently intelligence starts budding at about 34-to-38, or about the time many people register as Conservative Republican.

WildThing- thank you kindly for the video link- my heart swells with pride for our troops. God Bless our Troops- where ever they may SERVE this great country, even if it is on a campus where the students are holding such hate mongering signs.

Vern-
You are probably one of those "namby pamby beeding heart, shifty, can't make a decision , so you will change your stance under pressure at the drop of a hat liberals"- who, if you needed the troops to come and get your sorry butt out of a bad place, or if you had to save yourself or your Mother from the enemy- you would glady sacrifice your own Mother to save your sorry butt and then sell your sister into slavery- just like these dishonorable students who wave and hold signs proclaiming * F * the troops- * F * the army.

Don't be insipid- such behavior does NOT speak of supporting the troops. You can't have it both ways. Take a stance IF you can, you spineless man.You are nothing more than a fence sitting pseudo liberal.

Just sign me-

a Southern Doll , raised around the military my entire life, passionate patriot.

Vern!!!
Well Vern ol"buddy If your rant is an example
of a collage education you need to get your
money back!! You simple minded puke if it
wasn't for the military those little wet
behind the ears mush brained punks
wouldn't be able to protest like they are..
The girl in red could be arrested for
soliciting,I wonder if its one at a time or
just get in line...Vern FYI Im' a democrat
and have been for a hell of a long time
we used to be called Southern democrats
not bloody liberals...

Vern I will answer this part of what you questioned that I stated.............

"Please explain to me how these students are ignorant, stupid, users, communists, traitors to America and to our troops.

ignorant= yes I feel those protesting this war are ignorant and especially if they are students. To be a student means to be a person in the learning process and therefore should be aware of how this country was establilshed, the history of our Founding Fathers and how important the military has been to give us the freedoms we have. The wars and battles that have been fought to keep our Nation safe and secure. And to fight communisim from hopefully keep it from coming to our shores.

stupid=yep very stupid,following the crowd to be well liked, to try to fit in when it is more acceptable at a school to be against the troops then for them is stupid. It shows weakness and total lack of character.

users= most definetly users. Think about it. These students did not fight for my freedom nor theirs. It was GIVEN to them, it cost them nothing. They are ungrateful to those that paid for it (their freedom) , they USE their freedom to the max in their protesting but give no thanks to those that paid the price for it.....thus USERS. Have you not heard the expression of how a person uses another and it is seldom a good thing. I am not saying every child has to serve our country to be a good American and appreciate the freedoms we have but....BUT to attack those fighting to keep us safe and living in the land of the free, is unforgivable!!!!

communists= you are showing ignorance if you really believe there us not a socialist/conmmunist network pushing and backing the anti-war protests.

traitors to America and to our troops= HELL yes they are and I would say that to their face,live and in person. I could care less who is saying it, a politician, a CEO, a student, you name it. They are traitors to this country and to our troops if they say things against our military and our veterans.

As far as I am concerned the anti-war groups and followers can burn in hell!!!

Vern where the hell did you go? under your desk?
You shoot your mouth off and then you don't have
the guts to back it up!!! Its been said if bull
s@#t was music some folks would be a brass band
you can't cut it as a 1 man band!!!Rhod has
has your number just like the rest of us...
Say!! whats that smell, you step in something
Vern????

"And to fight communisim from hopefully keep it from coming to our shores."

Please try to remember what decade this is. There is only one communist state left large enough to pose a military threat to the US. And they dont show any signs of wanting to do so, prefering to maintain close economic ties but social isolation.

"you are showing ignorance if you really believe there us not a socialist/conmmunist network pushing and backing the anti-war protests."

Foilhead.

"They are traitors to this country and to our troops if they say things against our military and our veterans."

They didn't say anything about the veterans. Just the recruiters. The military isn't popular right now, and it will remain that way unless the US once again comes under military threat. And terrorism doesn't count - that is more a police/FBI/CIA thing than the soldiers-and-tanks military.

Vern went AWOL...Communisim is one thing,BUT
Radical Islam is a far grater danger and don't
think the likes of Russia and China are safe
from it,far from it...

Suricou Raven:

I know what decade this is, and Marxism and its variants are still alive and well in this country, particularly among the classes you seem to inhabit. The faux sophisticates and relativists. It exists in your country as well, and ignoring their potential for troublemaking establishes that you're not quite aware of the world around you.

Your last paragraph is a response to something which was neither said nor implied, and to say the least, your fatuity is undisturbed once again. Your deduction that the military is unpopular, and the students are angry at recruiters is so idiotic that one hardly knows what to say. This doesn't even rise to the level of a non sequitur.

But exceeding it all is your last revelation that "terrorism...is more a policeFBI/CIA thing" is astonishing. I won't question your sense of reason here, I question your sanity. I already know your response, but enlighten me on the subject of Iran. Surprise me with your brilliance.

I notice how clever and tricky Vern is with the play on words...Fright House and Faux News. A freshman of quality, to say the least, although he probably heard this from one of his advisors. We have to respect Vern's community college Liberal Arts Associates Degree. A man with that level of accomplishment is entitled to his politics, because no amount of persuasion would change him.

On the other hand, Vern and his kind go to great lengths to disparage their opposition in the usual ways. We're stupid, you see. It's the first and only stereotype that springs into the feeble mind of the young lefty. They have no others, chiefly because the first conceit of every lefty, however old, is superiority. It informs everything they think, say and claim to believe.

Vern, where are you kid? Defend yourself!

Suricou Raven a few years ago I was on a forum and a school teacher posted back to me that communisim does not exist that it died out. You remind me of her.

When you read you need to read what the words are saying not what you want them to say.

I said....."The wars and battles that have been fought to keep our Nation safe and secure. And to fight communisim from and hopefully keep it from coming to our shores.> I did not say we are fighitng communisim today from coming to our shores I said fought.

I am a foilhead? Per chance you have not read up on Soros and other heads of groups and the groups themselves even the ACLU has a socialist/ communist agenda for America, A.N.S.W.E.R. etc.

I will give you this one as correct....Vern did not mention Veterans nor did the vile protest I posted about.

But know this Raven, there is no line drawn between Veterans and those serving now. Just as there is NO line drawn between a father and a son. There is a Brotherhood of those that served and those that serve today and cannot be separated. It is a Brotherhood that ONLY those that have served can be a part of.
So when you see protest toward our military of today you damn well better know it is not selective at just those now, it is all encompassing and reflects in everyway on our Veterans and what ingrates the protestors are for even the reason they can protest.

Just because the Soviet Union no longer exists doesn’t mean Communism went away. Communism is an idea, a belief in a way of life. In theory if you study it, it sounds good but in order to achieve it you have to achieve pure socialism first. The Soviet Union died trying to achieve pure socialism but now European nations are picking up the cause. The names have changed but he players are still the same.

Maybe I should serve tea today in case Vern comes back. It is almost tea time here in Florida. :)

English Double Devon cream,Lemon Curd, scones,Walkers shortbread,Cadbury chocolates, tea sandwiches........(yum)

http://www.theodoresworld.net/pics/0406/kittyteatime.jpg

Hey, WT. I just gained a few pounds. Walker's, Devon cream and Cadbury's? There's a nice tea room in York, up near the Cathedral I'd recommend.

giggle.....I miss having tea. I used to have Tea Room that we had adjacant to my little gift shop in Malibu, Calif.
The gift shop and tea room were called......

Theodore's Shoppe

We served both tea and high tea and celebrated all the American, English and Scottish holidays. Robert Burns day and even had Haggis and a man that played the Bagpipe. Gosh I love the Bagpipes.

Things on my shoppe's menu were Sheppards pie, bangers etc. I also had a tiny grocery area in the gift shoppe that sold McVities, Branston relish ( yum) and all the various teas, English clotted cream, Hob Nobs, Marmite, Crunchies
(they are really good) heh heh, and Maltezers
(spelling not sure of it has been awhile) haha

OK Now I am starving and have to go fix dinner. hahahaa

I wish I had visited the tea room you mentioned in York. I bet it was wonderful. I did get to go to a lot of them all over Ebgland, but York was one place I missed.

Thanks Rhod for the happy memories. And fattening ones too. hahaahhaahhaa

There is no doubt that Communism still is a
problem in the world to day but not to the
extent that radical Islam is...The EU is
going to stop using the term Islamic terrorist
so as not to upset the bad boys...England,
France and Germany along with the scandnavian
Countrys have very large Muslim populations
The bombers in England were all home grown
nice boys they were!!Its called World domination
under Islamic rule...If you think thats a pipe
dream well when some poor soul looking for his
70 virgins blows one in Disney land or the
Super Bowl you might get the picture...Don't
for get they hate the communist as bad as the Americans...I suggest you read the book Jawbraker, The hunt for Osama bin Lauden ,there is a
quote on the back that goes"Read this book
remember it put it a way and the when Al-Qaida
sets off a dirty bomb you will know who signed
The death warrants for 10s of thousnds of your
countrymen!! Think about it...

Thanks Tincan Sailor, I love your posts.

I will tap dance on the windpipe of anyone that tries to harm Michelle Malkin or her family.

All she has to do is say the word and an Army of folks like me will come runnin to her neighborhood.

We will protect her the same way the Bikers protect the military families.

GO 'HEAD, MAKE MY DAY.

Richard Davis
Philadelphia, PA
USN Ret

WildThing-
I saw this mentioned somewhere here....I found you a link

"Arlington"

http://www.weezye.net/arlington/arlington.html

Toby Keith

God Bless Our Troops...especially when they have to put up with an event as sad as dealing with people who don't appreciate the sacrifice some of them make...

Good night

Doll

We served both tea and high tea and celebrated all the American, English and Scottish holidays. Robert Burns day and even had Haggis and a man that played the Bagpipe. Gosh I love the Bagpipes.

Hey, my wife's grandfather is ... Robert Burns. Yes, he's of Scot descent. One of the faculty at where I work (USF) is of Scot ancestry and plays bagpipes, skillfully I might add. When he plays Amazing Grace it is awe inspiring.

Suricou Raven, I can vouch for what Wild Thing says about the vets and active duty. Family on both sides are/were military. If you think insulting/protesting/etc. active duty doesn't "get the vets dander up", you're sadly mistaken. The vets will always be marine, sailor, soldier, airman, etc. Just witness a vet and active duty talk to each other. It's like the vet never left the service. You cannot do what these spoiled brats did and say you respect the vets. You insult one, you insult all.

Just wait until that "smart" young girl in the red shirt finds out her signs will have to be in Spanish

I have it playing now Doll. Thank you so much this is so wonderful!!
Sweet dreams

Tom.........
"Just wait until that "smart" young girl in the red shirt finds out her signs will have to be in Spanish"...........

Good one! What you said says a lot!!!!

Bob excellent and so true. It is just the names that have changed!

Sierrahome, that does happen like you said. Thanks.

Hi Richard, it is awful what they are doing to Michelle Malkin or her family. It really has me upset.
Thank you for coming by, it is nice to meet you. Thank you also for serving our country.

razOr that is fantastic!!! I love hearing about it and thank you soooo much for sharing about your wife's grandfather being of Scottish descent.
There is a sound with Bagpipes that nothing else equals. To me it is haunting and so beautiful. That is so neat that that you got to hear Amazing Grace like that. Thanks so much razOr.

I was refering to the more shadowy, secretive type of terrorist. The most infamous group is Al Quieda, of course. The Iraq insurgents are another example. The military can provide sheer force, but to find the terrorists you need a department optimised for investigations. Its a law-enforcement task. And when you do find them, they are in small groups in friendly cities. So what use are tanks, bombers and artillary?

Iran is a military threat. Though not to the US - even if they produce a nuclear weapon, and even if they do some missile upgrading, their range is still only enough to reach the easten part of Europe. They could try to smuggle a nuke into the US, but then they become the shadowy, conspiring terrorists who the military is ill-suited to handle.

What the military *could* be used for in this situation is a preemptive attack on Iran's nuclear facilities before they have any nuclear weapons. That way even Europe is safe from them. Easy enough to drop a few bombs. Such actions would probably start a process resulting in eventual war though, and seriously harm the reputation of the US, so it isn't really an option without some real proof of intent to develop nuclear capability. Even though everyone knows that is exactly what Iran intends. Something like, say, a defecting scientist bringing a sample of uranium refined beyond the point needed for a reactor. That would be sufficient, I think, to justify military action.

Iran,need a fix for this!! BIRD FLU..No muss
no fuss, problem solved!!!!

Tincan Sailor heh heh sounds like an ad. hahaha

Suricou Raven ,
I trust you have never heard of Black-Ops,Delta
Force,Army Rangers, Navy seals,Marine Force
Recon and Sniper units of all of the above...
The thing about these units is the fact they
go about there job in the shadows and they
have been most excellent at it...If OL'OBL
is still alive (I have my doubts,EGO) He
never knows when the next knock on his door
could be one of these fine Gentelmen,I doubt
he would live to enjoy the meeting...And lets
talk about the Snipers it only takes one shot,
It has been done at over 2400 yrds, Carlos aka
White Feather in Vietnam,I Shot 1 KILL ALL YOU
FEEL IS THE RECOIL... Lets put that aside for
now there is a feeling I have and I dont like it
and after reading MICHAEL YON to day it confirms
my feelings(ie) a large sector of the American
public is begining to turn their back on our
troops and that is pure bull S@#t,we have asked
these folks to do a job and they have done it in SPADES

Part 2 to the above,The Iraqis are trying under
conditions most of us couldn't handle.Both of
these factions are being screwed by the MSM and
our own Goverment!!!!!the Congress and the
Senate need to get off their dead ass and get
this job done and the MAN himself needs to get
off the dime...I DON'T WANT THESE KIDS SCREWED
LIKE THE GUYS OF MY TIME, "VIETNAM",If you
want to know what really is going on then check
in with Michael Yon,Michael Totten and Bill
Riggo,All three are in Afgahnistan covering the
forgoten war..Riggo is packing 1 of my cameras,
on loan for the cause...Ok folks its time to look
your self in the mirror and say am I doing enough
if it comes down to it send Larry The Cable Guy
he knows how to GIT-R-DONE...

Tincan Sailor, GIT-R-DONE heh heh love it.

The students in SAW are in fact communists and socialists. They are very honest and upfront about it.

Interested parties should view their posts on:

http://www.indybay.org/santacruz/

and join their Yahoo group:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ucsc_antiwar/

and one of their originals:

http://www.fiatpax.net/

and of course:

http://www.corporateswine.net/

(which results in vandalism of "Corpy" stickers all over town).

Recently students from campus dressed all in black and riding bicycles slashed the tires of SUVs and painted slogans on them:

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=local&id=4090514

That is actually quite common, and the local Ford dealer has been attacked several times.

The climate on campus is very bad. Professors and students who do not agree with the radical agenda are demonized. Students are assaulted. Windows are broken. Faculty members suspected of having ties with the military are subject to verbal and written attacks.

Keep in mind that not all students and faculty there are lunatics. There is an active student republican group.

Wild Thing, I will respond to your answers. Nearly everything else directed at me is nothing more than standard anti-liberal vitriol.

ignorant= yes I feel those protesting this war are ignorant and especially if they are students. To be a student means to be a person in the learning

Why are they ignorant for protesting, and why more so if they are students?

To be a student means to be a person in the learning process and therefore should be aware of how this country was establilshed, the history of our Founding Fathers and how important the military has been to give us the freedoms we have.

How our country was established is irrelevant to the discussions of this war or protests against it. Our country was founded partly to escape religious persecution. But it was also to escape the domination of the ruling class in Europe.

The Founding Fathers would likely not support this war. If you think otherwise, perhaps you also need more education about them and the reasons they did what they did.
Don't think so?
Mexico ring a bell?
How about France?

More importantly, the military is not currently defending my freedoms. It is presumably attempting to defend the newfound freedoms of the Iraqi people, but specifically what they are doing is wide open for debate.

And to fight communisim from hopefully keep it from coming to our shores.

I don't really know why you made this statement, unless you truly don't understand communism or the current America or the current military conflicts.

stupid=yep very stupid,following the crowd to be well liked, to try to fit in when it is more acceptable at a school to be against the troops then for them is stupid. It shows weakness and total lack of character.

You of course have proof that these same protesters have at any point "tried to fit in" by being "for them" at some point? Otherwise, you are merely berating them for the purposes of bolstering your argument.

By the way, good to see that you aren't "following the crowd"...

users=....They are ungrateful to those that paid for it.....they USE their freedom to the max in their protesting but give no thanks to those that paid the price for it

Again, you must have proof that they are indeed ungrateful to anyone who has fought. Because, protesting against the war in Iraq is not quite the same thing as being ungrateful to, say, those who fought in WWI or WWII. Much as you might like to say it's the same, it isn’t. If you insist in that logic, than you muse accept that Bill Clinton did as much for the citizenry of the United States as either Bush or Reagan ever did. After all, he nearly eliminated the deficit. Can't say that, can you? Also, do you have any evidence that these protesters have "never" given thanks? Doubtful.

communists= you are showing ignorance if you really believe there us not a socialist/conmmunist network pushing and backing the anti-war protests.

Network? Seriously? Do you envision the rise from the ashes of the Soviet Union? Perhaps they have socialist ideals. But a network? You need to get out more.

traitors to America and to our troops= HELL yes they are and I would say that to their face,live and in person. I could care less who is saying it, a politician, a CEO, a student, you name it. They are traitors to this country and to our troops if they say things against our military and our veterans.

As far as I am concerned the anti-war groups and followers can burn in hell!!!

So, because they disagree with the government, and speak out saying so, they should burn in hell?
Perhaps you should re-read your statement in response to the ignorant thing.
Specifically;

should be aware of how this country was establilshed, the history of our Founding Fathers

Of course, the Founding Fathers NEVER spoke out against the government, did they?

I ANXIOUSLY await your next round of unsound reasoning and rethuglican buzz words.

Both of these factions are being screwed by the MSM and our own Goverment!!!!!the Congress and the Senate need to get off their dead ass and get this job done and the MAN himself needs to get off the dime...I DON'T WANT THESE KIDS SCREWED LIKE THE GUYS OF MY TIME, "VIETNAM"

Oh dear, Tincan, it appears you must now suffer the wrath of you and your ilk, and of course Wild Thing. You have spoken out AGAINST YOUR OWN GOVERNMENT!!!! TRAITOR!!!!

Fuck You Bitch! You have no idea what you are talking about. We were not asked to come to Iraq we are a bull in a china shop only the difference is we are killing innocent people, babies and should get the hell out! You condone murder of innocent lives and it is a good thing the recruiters cut and ran.

"Keep in mind that not all students and faculty there are lunatics. There is an active student republican group."

I have been a forum troll for a long time now, but never before have I seen a sentence which so clearly demonstrates the ability to dismiss opposing viewpoints without concious consideration.

Vern,.....Oh, never mind.....Paulo, try to stay away from the tequila.
Billy

Vern:

You're clearly a product of the modern American educational system. There was also nothing vitriolic in my remarks to you. I began by asking you to defend your comments, and followed that with an observation about something you actually did. This, of course, in your slim capacity for reason, counts as vitriole. Vitriole, BTW, is a cliche and overused. Crack the Freshman grammar books before you sit down to write. I expect some answers to the question below.

Allow me to comment on your truly pitiful responses to WT:

You begin by conflating protest with intelligence. That is, your rather silly conclusion is that a protestor cannot be ignorant. This isn't an ignorant conclusion, it's stupid. Are none of the protesters ignorant?

Your feeble and confused analysis of WT's comment about the Founding Fathers and the military is to offer the grade school explanation of the European migration to this continent. Why? You, unsurprisingly, make no sense.

Pronouncing that the "Founding Fathers" wouldn't support this war has really overburdened your intelligence and education. Explain. Don't offer cryptic comments about France and Mexico. Try really hard. I'm unimpressed.

Your sentence about the military not defending your freedom and your maundering commentary about Iraq is undermined by your own conclusion that the issues are "wide open to debate". Well, which is it genius? Your view or is it uncertain? Try really hard again.

Communism? I get it. Marxism is exhausted, moribund and exists nowhere in the world, nor does authoritarianism, statism and collectivism? By claiming that WT doesn't understand the issue, you imply that you do. Try really hard again. Explain genius.

Group think? You reject the idea. Does it exist or not? Explain, genius.

No one could clearcut the impenetrable maze of presumed logic that you use for your "ungrateful" paragraph. Sort this one out. But in so doing, are you grateful to the American military, and in what way? And to whom? Let's hear what you have to say about the military, so we know more about you.

Are you prepared to say that there is no nihilist, anarchist, syndicalist, Marxist, green, communist (small "c"), socialist or other influences in these protests. Actually you have. Are you denying it? And if so, describe the event.

Your last couple of paragraphs in your response to WT, and the absolutely puerile and wild-eyed silliness with Tincan Sailor leave no doubt that you're a pretentious, arrogant, simple-minded naif who is, in the end, no challenge. But, given that you imagine yourself up to the task, answer the questions posed and we can get somewhere.

...Oh yes, Vern. Just an observation. You seem to have spent some time polishing up a very limited talent for debate and analysis. And you haven't done too badly, except that you're anchored by your own bad temper, your blindingly childish perceptions and the lightness of your intellect. Given time, you might amount to something, but I want to keep this going. Hope you come back.

Paulo, on the other hand, is a vulgar imbecile. There's a slight chance that he's a winger plant because the probability of someone actually being that stupid is pretty small. But, considering that he's responding to a thread on the university system, he's probably a dean, a department chairman or a teaching assistant. Maybe even a branch administrator. He's almost certainly an education major or a product of an ed department in some high-priced school.

Suricou:

Disclosing the (possibly intentional) contrast in Luigi's paragraph between lunatics and Republicans was unworthy. Luigi had much more to say, with several links, and yet you apply your efforts to finding a literary oversight. I happen to like the comparative, but never mind. I've been trying to take you seriously, but it's getting harder all the time.

Dear Vern and Paulo,
If you are really having that hard a time understanding why we need a military, remember this....We aren't speaking German, thank your Grandfather.....We aren't speaking Russian, thank your Dad,...How's your Arabic? One more thing, in case you forgot, or you were playing NINTENDO at the time, here's a link, please make sure the sound is on and be thankfull your friends or family weren't there.
www.albertarose.org/Remember/images/page1.htm

Billy

Dear Billy(Bob? I presume)
I thank those that served in WWI nearly daily, but you would not know or understand.
I thank those that served in WWII nearly daily.
I thank those that served in Korea and Vietnam nearly daily.
I thank those that served in Granada. I thank those that served in Bush Sr's Gulf War.
I thank those that served and continue to serve in both Afghanistan and Iraq.
As for Russian, that's more the result of clandestine ops than military, but we'll overlook that.
However, there has been no attempted push into any area of the world by Saddam Hussein that he did not feel was part of the original Iraq.
Unlike Hitler, who truly sought world domination.
The start of WWI is more akin to when Hussein entered Kuwait; it was one country feeling like they were controlled by another and shouldn't be.

There was never a time that we would have spoken Korean or Chinese, since we started that.
Same goes for Vietnamese. (We didn't start it, but we sure felt like we could/should finish it)

There was never a time we would have spoken Spanish as a result of Granada. Never would have spoken Arabic from the first Gulf War. Never would have spoken Arabic from the attacks on 9/11.

There has never been a direct threat to this continent from outside forces since WWII, with the sole exception being the attacks on 9/11.

The attackers were overwhelmingly Saudi, and their alleged training camps were in Afghanistan. We went into Afghanistan and (mostly) kicked ass.
So, tell me brainiac, how can you justify the war in Iraq?

H0ow do you know my family or friends weren't there?

You should learn the true definition of ASSumption, ASS.

If I did forget, it would be because our pathetic excuse for a president, vice-president, sec. of defense, sec. of state, etc, etc, etc keep pushing Iraq down my throat.
Of course, that's about the only way they, and by extension you, can ever accomplish anything.

I've never owned or played Nintendo.

In case you forgot, like your president;
http://www.katrinatribute.info/

There was also nothing vitriolic in my remarks to you.

Definitions of vitriol on the Web:

• (H2SO4) a highly corrosive acid made from sulfur dioxide; widely used in
  the chemical industry
  
• expose to the effects of vitriol or injure with
  vitriol
  
• subject to bitter verbal abuse
  
• vituperation: abusive or venomous language used to express
  blame or censure or bitter deep-seated ill will
  wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

I emphasized the ones that would apply here;

On the other hand, Vern and his kind go to great lengths to disparage their
opposition in the usual ways. We're stupid, you see. It's the first and only
stereotype that springs into the feeble mind of the young lefty. They have no
others, chiefly because the first conceit of every lefty, however old, is
superiority. It informs everything they think, say and claim to
believe.

You're right, Rhod... Nothing vitriolic there...

Allow me to comment on your truly pitiful responses to
WT:

Good to see you continuing the "no vitriol" tradition...

You begin by conflating protest with intelligence.

I did? Where's that?

That is, your rather silly conclusion is that a protestor cannot be
ignorant.

No, sorry. What I said was;

Why are they ignorant for protesting, and why more so if they are
students?

Wild Thing's conclusion that they are ignorant
because they are students and ergo should know the history of the
United States is ludicrous. Their supposed ignorance is nothing more than an
opinion, based on it bring different than yours.

This isn't an ignorant conclusion, it's stupid. Are none of the
protesters ignorant?

As is yours and WTs. Are none of the protesters intelligent?

Your feeble and confused analysis of WT's comment about the
Founding Fathers and the military is to offer the grade school explanation of
the European migration to this continent.

Wow. You didn't actually get any education, it would
appear.

Here's what I actually said;

How our country was established is irrelevant to the discussions of
this war or protests against it. Our country was founded partly to escape
religious persecution. But it was also to escape the domination of the ruling
class in Europe.

Kinda goes a little further than your synopsis of it would indicate,
but I'll attribute that to you being a fucking moron.

Pronouncing that the "Founding Fathers" wouldn't support this war
has really overburdened your intelligence and education.

Seems to me like it overburdened your education and distinct
lack of intelligence.

Explain. Don't offer cryptic comments about France and
Mexico.

If you insist on being stupid, I will at least attempt to enlighten
you;

If the Founding Fathers had been interested in spreading
democracy far and wide at any cost (which is a claim Shrub has made) then they
likely would not have fought so hard to get the Mexicans out of the portions of
the United States they occupied at that time, as that would have been quite
un-democratic.

As for France;

After the French Revolution, the United States
refused to pay back its debt and revoked its agreements with France, arguing
that these had been with the French monarchy and that their obligations were
null after the change of regime in France. Meanwhile, the United States
signed, on November 19th, 1794, Jay's Treaty with the United Kingdom, against
French corsairs.
Source: Wikipedia

Since you seem so convinced that the
Founding Fathers would support this war, explain your
position.

Your sentence about the military not
defending your freedom and your maundering commentary about Iraq is undermined
by your own conclusion that the issues are "wide open to debate". Well, which
is it genius?

It's both, moron. They aren't defending my
freedoms. They are presumably defending the newfound freedoms of
Iraqis, however, that, is open for debate. Additionally, with the myriad
revelations of abuse, misconduct, criminal negligence, extortion, fraud,
embezzlement, etc., it's open for debate whether they are defending
anyone's freedom.

Idiot.

Communism? I get it. Marxism is
exhausted, moribund and exists nowhere in the world, nor does
authoritarianism, statism and collectivism? By claiming that WT doesn't
understand the issue, you imply that you do. Try really hard again. Explain
genius.

Well, genius, it's real simple;
communism is less likely to stamp out the military than you are;

Definitions of communism on the
Web:

• 
  A governmental system that encourages the
  elimination of private property and the equitable distribution of goods to
  the public. A Communist government maintains central control over banking,
  business, housing, education, industry, medical care, the military, and
  regional security forces.
  www.whitneystewart.com/DXP/Glossary.htm

It would appear that you understand the
issue as well as WT.

Perhaps if these people were protesting for
more free education, or protesting against bad labor laws, you might have a
valid point. As it is, you just continue to display your stupidity.

Group think? You reject the idea. Does it
exist or not? Explain, genius.

Are you asking me a question? Because your
particular form of 3rd grade grammar and punctuation make it difficult to
tell.

If you are indeed asking a question, please
tell me this; how would one explain group think existing or not existing? You
could as easily explain why republicans are all stupid southerners.

No one could clearcut the impenetrable
maze of presumed logic that you use for your "ungrateful"
paragraph.

Sorry I got over your head. I was trying to
keep it simple and use grade-school language. Apparently I dropped in too many
higher education words and phrases.

As for me, yes, I am grateful to the
American military. As for what way, none of your fucking business. I sure don't
need to explain myself to the likes of you.

Hell, do you even know if I have
been in the military? Of course not. You're far too stupid to think
that someone who questions this war could have been in the military.

Let's hear what you have to say about the
military, so we know more about you.

Right. Because you haven't already made up
your mind about me...

Are you prepared to say that there is no
nihilist, anarchist, syndicalist, Marxist, green, communist (small "c"),
socialist or other influences in these protests.

I never said that, moron. However, WT
did say;

you are showing ignorance if you really
believe there us not a socialist/conmmunist
network pushing and backing the anti-war
protests

Not quite the same thing...

Actually you have.

Where?

pretentious, arrogant, simple-minded
naif

Wow. Did you come up with those words all
by yourself, or did you Google for words that would make you sound smart?

BTW, since you seem to think that you are
deserving of answers, perhaps you would be willing to answer some of my
questions;
Did you serve active duty in the military?
What branch?
What
year did you enter?
Are you still in?
What pay grade are/were
you?
Rank?
Ever serve in combat?
What level education did you have
prior to entering the military?
What level education do you now
possess?
What do you do for employment?

Lastly;

Vitriole, BTW, is a cliche and overused.

Vitriol is not spelled with an e at the end, and, redundant
much?

Wild Thing, thanks for approving my response. My apologies for double submitting it...

Dear Vern,

Wow, you really need to get laid. Other than the mild NINTENDO comment I really didn't think I was getting too personal. You're right, I assumed you didn't have friends or family there. Thank you for correcting me, now I'm sure. While reading your tirade I kept waiting for the hook and there, down at the bottom of your comment it was. The Katrina relief fund??????? You have got to be kidding me !!! I didn't know Nagin had a son. When I read your first post on this topic, I said to myself, "Self, this guy sounds like one of those guys who hates the military, hates the government, but would be the first to be yelling WHERE'S FEMA!" Then I said, "Nah, don't be so critical." I have yo remember to never second guess myself. You truly are a piece of work. Are you sure you can't speak Arabic? Have a nice life.

Yours in Allah,
Billy

What makes you think I hate the government?

What makes you think I hate the military?

What makes you think I'd be the first yelling where's FEMA?

Talk about needing to get laid...

Vern said: If I did forget, it would be because our pathetic excuse for a president, vice-president, sec. of defense, sec. of state, etc, etc, etc keep pushing Iraq down my throat.

Your right Vern, our pathetic excuse for a president kept pushing Iraq down our throats all throughout the 90’s. He had us flying round-the-clock air cover for the Kurds in Northern Iraq. He continually preached Iraq is the greatest threat to world peace and our national security. Unfortunately this pathetic excuse for an American and man never did anything to stop Iraq except lob a few Cruise Missiles at them.
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1998/12/16/transcripts/clinton.html

Here are a few quotes to refresh your memory.

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998.

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.

"Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."
Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998.

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999.

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

Yup, that pathetic excuse of a President sure rammed Iraq down our throats for almost a decade.

Well, Vern, it took nothing at all to smoke you out. You see, the central issue with a posturing, vile little clown like you, is your indestructible sense of superiority, your vanity, your conceit. Your first post was saturated with it; the first resort of every lefty...a tendency more like a mental disorder than any set of ideas, is to scorn his opposition. We need an anthropologist to understand you, asshole, not a political scientist. It's so easy to prick the vanity and empty the bladder of a doof like you.

Do you feel spent now, dickeweed? Was it good for you, you dysfunctional little shit? First to your questions. I have my Masters, I'm sixty years old, I served in Vietnam with the 25th Division for nearly 14 months in combat in 1966 and 1967 (extended my tour, I had two years of college before I went in), I have three educated and bright sons in the current war, two with the 101st and one formerly part of the 82nd now attached to the 10th Mountain.

One is in Iraq, another in Afghanistan, and the third is going back in August for the second time. That's all you will know about them. For myself, I don't discuss rank, experience, wounds physical or emotional, medals or reasons with veterans, so I wouldn't discuss them with some fucking shit-for-brains poseur on the Internet. Now, what's your reason for asking? Chickenhawk argument?

Your response is so dimwitted and willfully obstuse that I hardly know where to start. Your peckertracks above, up to your dimwittery about the Founding Fathers, is ignorable. Read your first post again, you yammering idiot, and try to understand it, and you might get your scant intelligence working on the objections if you could only understand the implications of YOUR OWNS WORDS.

If I type this really slow, maybe you can grasp it. Neither of us knows what the "Founding Fathers" (who were they?) would think or recommend about the Iraq War, about International Realism, The Bush Doctrine or what the purpose and posture of the large commercial republic known as the US should be in a world plagued by Islamism. You also discount or fail to understand the dangers of resurgent Islamic imperialism in the world, so your freedoms seem secure to you, or at least self-generating.

We also don't know what the Founding Fathers would think of partial birth abortion, gay marriage or a host of other issues. But I understand that you're entirely too primitive, especially at feeding time, to comprehend the difficulties here, so I'll move on.

The balance of your post after the FF remark, seems to have been aggravated by your enuresis. You see, self-importance is never a substitute for thinking, vern. What you've done is defend your fragile little ego because that's what this is about. Not protests, not politics, not me, not WT or anything else, Vern old boy. This is about vern, about vern, about vern and still about vern, about hammering your tune on the tiny anvil of your brain. What a joke.

Here's an exercise for you, Vern. Be specific. Your deuling banjo approach to debate...isolating thoughts and criticizing them...measures your meager talents, but it gets nowhere. See if you're up to the mental challenge, vern. Describe the protest and protesters in your own words. Try to do it without reference to someone else's opinion, be creative, verm. Be imaginative. Let your musty, dank little soul fly, kid, and tell us what you think about something other than yourself.

Vern:

Forgot this. You've been aching to tell us all about your military experience. It shows. Well, I don't give a shit whether you served or not. It means nothing to me, nor does my own military experience lend validity to anything we've talked about.

It seems to mean a lot to you, because you want to lower the hammer on a presumed civilian by going Patton at the right moment. Otherwise, you wouldn't have asked the questions. You're too predicatable, vern. Amateur.

Billy I love your blog, you have a fantastic sense of humor!

Wild Thing,

Thank you so much. I'm flattered by your praise and let me say that you have done an impressive job here. I have been checking in on your blog for some months now and refer it to friends and enemies alike. The friends love it and the enemies take longer to return phone calls. My blog can't hold a candle to what you have done here. I really am just fumbling around with it and learning as I go. There are many things I need to learn, (when time permits). I'm glad you enjoy it, Thank you again, for your compliments, and your blog.

Billy

Rhod,
2 responses. 2 responses is all it took before you devolved into mindless railing against that which you can not comprehend.

In case you were not aware, Clinton was continuing a Bush policy.

It was truly a pleasure, but as you state, I am obviously far too caught up in my own sense of self-worth to prolong your diatribe.

Perhaps you could stick your head outside once in a while. You might realize that the "dangers of resurgent Islamic imperialism in the world" are more a creation of the Bush adminstration and their news media bitches than reality.

As for answering my questions, you must have missed the day where they taught you how to read everything before you start answering.

S'okay, I understand.

You will likely assume I am not sincere, but that matters not.
Thank you for your service.
Thank you and your sons for their service.
I hope your sons all return to you unscathed.

As for wondering why I asked; just confirming what I already knew.

Hey! Vern came in from the cold?how nice well
the same old bloviating, Iraq aside you stupid
SOB lets hit KATRINA,You bet your sweet ass
there were mistakes made but you tell the
Coast Guard,Army,Navy,Air Force and Fish and
game Helicopter Pilots and Air Crews that were
flying in the first hours of the storm that
the Goverment was slow to respond,tell it face
to face you little piss ant...3 days yes 3 days
there was a major goverment response,now Ill
give you a little home work,Read the March
2006 issue of Popular Mechanics "KATRINA
Debunking the Myths,what really happened,what
to do next time,might open your eyes but I
doubt it...Iraq if you have to ask why, you
wouldn't understand anyway...And yes I can fault
the Goverment and still support them at the
same time dip shit...There isnt any thing wrong
with UCSC that opening a large can of Whup ass
wouldn't take care of....

Rhod..... Exactly!

"Here's an exercise for you, Vern. Be specific. Your deuling banjo approach to debate...isolating thoughts and criticizing them...measures your meager talents, but it gets nowhere. See if you're up to the mental challenge, vern. Describe the protest and protesters in your own words. Try to do it without reference to someone else's opinion, be creative, verm. Be imaginative. Let your musty, dank little soul fly, kid, and tell us what you think about something other than yourself."

Tincan Sailor, "There isnt any thing wrong
with UCSC that opening a large can of Whup ass
wouldn't take care of...."

I agree!!

And yes vern you just let the cat out of the
bag as to how really out of touch you are!!!
I have a Pakistani Brother-in-law and let me
give you a tip, Radical Islam may only comprise
15-20% of all Islam but they scare the crap out
of the rest...This thing with the Radical
Islamics began in the summer of 72 check it out
and has been getting biger and better every
since,but if its all bull shit you don't have
a thing to worry about,unless W is watching you
that youll never know till its to late!!!YOU
COULD BE AN ENEMY OF THE STATE...

Vern:

I'll take the contrarian view here and surmise that you might actually be correct on some issues, and even have the right instincts on a lot of others. I'm on record elsewhere as disagreeing sharply with the war in Iraq, but for reasons other than yours. We might have had something to discuss, if you had not arrived on this blog in full lefty plumage, with the standing arguments of your kind.

You are, of course, mistaken on so many things, even though you probably believe all of it, which is no crime...but in your case, something of a waste of your intellect.

Let's summarize. You came here in your first post with the primary stereotype of conservatives. We're stupid. When I treated you in the same way, your ego was wounded, and you descended immediately into vulgarity, evasion and pompous condescension.

(BTW, one doesn't "Google words, so maybe that's your problem. You've been Googling "How to Sound Smart" and you didn't get any answers. And Wickpedia is unreliable as a source for anything.)

But, when I reacted to you, again, in the same thatway you treated me/us, you slipped into some not-so-clever scheme of asking me personal questions, which you later contaminated by saying you "already knew" what the response would be, therefore stereotyping me again. The implied condemnation of me or my sons in your remark certainly damages your final wishes, but I take them as sincere nevertheless.

There are several problems here. The things WT said about the protesters were widely true, even though maybe not true of all of them. Paulo is an example, and his presence undermined your attempt to clarify and differentiate between the idiot Paulos and the presumably sincere Verns. You had a chattering buffoon representing your side, but you ignored the potentialities. He did more damage to you than I did.

Second, you've either been educated by historicists or are, unwittingly, one yourself. Reading back into history conclusions you've already made about the present, is a temporary and sick fatuity in the academy, and does you no credit. We know what the FF said about the military, but deducing from a Wickpedia entry what they (Madison, Hamilton, Jay, Jefferson, et al) would have believed about the Iraq War is simply silly.

Third, the cheapest, most specious kind of moral sanctimony...the memes about torture and the rest as a means to condemn the Iraq War in general, are cynical and hypocritical. Would you have supported the policy in their absence? No. The questions for you are larger, and you have yet to describe any of them, except to dismiss out of hand the dysfunctional complaints of modernity in the Muslim world. To ignore this entirely is your fatal error.

In any case, apologies for the hards words. I take no pleasure in it. Thank you for the gracious conclusion, too. It mattered.

Let me make sure you clearly understand something, lest you maintain your misplaced sense of moral superiority;

The implied condemnation of me or my sons in your remark certainly damages your final wishes, but I take them as sincere nevertheless.

If you believe for one moment that I was anything less than sincere because of anything else I have said, you have proven yourself to far more reactionary and far more susceptible to "group-think" than I could ever be.
I have lost family members and friends to the military, both in and out of combat zones. Do not for a second think that because you perceive me to be a bleating-heart liberal that you can put me in some sort of convenient, easy-to-hate box.

It offends me that you, as a claimed veteran of what is arguably one of the most unpopular wars ever fought, would have the gall to distort an honest thanks for you and your sons service and sacrifice.

Moreover, you have proven yourself an entirely unworthy opponent.

Vern:

From Vern to me at 12:28 PM, April 26, 2006...

"As for wondering why I asked; just confirming what I already knew".

Again, vern, if you don't want your words to be misinterpreted, be more specific. Reactionary? What the hell does THAT mean? Group think? What you "already knew", as claimed, was that my comments somehow defined me as a military person. Why is that, vern? Why would you already know it? Sterotyping? Profiling? The crude, primitive locutions and dense thinking of the old soldier? What? Why would you already know it, vern?

I explained this to you in my first paragraph above. If I was wrong, maybe less indignation would be in order, as you already know that, in two separate places, I expressed gratitude for your wishes.

But, have it as you wish. Apparently your thanks are conditional on my worthiness and your pleasure in your own perfection. How easy it is for you to retract a sentiment when the recipient isn't worthy of it. So much depends upon my perceived good behavior with you.

Why don't you be honest, vern. A "convenient, easy- to-hate box?" Read your first post here, vern, and learn a lesson about hate...from yourself. The contagion of your hatred led to this entire exchange. "...bleating heart liberal"? You aren't a liberal, you're a lefty. I doubt that you understand what liberalism is.

To quote myself, and I still mean it:

"In any case, apologies for the harsh words. I take no pleasure in it. Thank you for the gracious conclusion, too. It mattered."

Rhod you are a lot nicer then I would be.Thank you for being a part of team Theodore.

How easy it is for you to retract a sentiment when the recipient isn't worthy of it.

Your failure to read and/or comprehend must be a source of great shame to your teachers at any level.

Please, in your infinite wisdom, display to me exactly where you saw me retract my sentiments.

Let me again quote you, since you apparently have a selective memory;

The implied condemnation of me or my sons in your remark

What condemnation?

While I would not necessarily group you in with the likes of Billy, you have no qualms about grouping me in with the likes of Paulo.

My "already knew" statement was nearly accurate. Veteran, likely Vietnam. Family, perhaps children, currently active military. Educated. Likely to be reduced to vicious attack stage with little provocation.

I think this dog has been beat to death,Rhod
you have taken the high road as for myself I
have spent 35 yrs.in high voltage line const.
I just call it as I see it or as they say a
spade is a spade...Folks that use and abuse
everything this Country has to offer and don't
give back when the chips are down tend to piss
me off and I won't soft talk them,they arn't
worth a second of my time,one day they will
be sucking hind tit...

Sir Vern,
I thought I told you to have a nice life. Go pick on someone your own IQ.

Billy

Vern:

"Likely to be reduced to vicious attack stage with little provocation"....I'm still laughing, vern...hahahahaaha..."vicious attack stage". Someday I'll find a way to lampoon this...hahahahaha..Bye, vern. You've been fun.

Tincan and Billy:

You're right. Nothing gained.

Rhod,

I have to admire your tenacity but as Tincan said, some people are just a lost cause. I think someone needs to up his dose of PROZAC. I would have engaged further with him but my eyes are permanently crossed from conversations I've had with my second ex wife. Nice try though....!

Billy